Gerald Patout
Arnold LeDoux Library
Louisiana State University
Eunice, LA

“And then when of course you put good rice dressing in a casing, people call that boudin.” – Gerald Patout

Even as a young librarian with a case of wanderlust, Gerald Patout never quite left his home base of Acadiana. While living in New York City, for example, he worked for the Domino Sugar company—a providential match seeing as how Gerald grew up in one of Louisiana’s most influential sugar-producing families. Also in New York, he taught Cajun cooking classes. Eventually he made his way back to Louisiana, first working at the Historic New Orleans Collection in the French Quarter for a decade, and then returning to Acadiana to direct the Arnold LeDoux Library on the LSU campus at Eunice. That last move brought him closer to many things of value: family, a slower pace of life, and boudin. As an academic, Gerald offers perspective regarding the cultural import of Cajun boudin, as well as theories about how its invention. As an eater, he tells us where to get some and how to serve it.

NOTE: What follows is a portion of the original interview that has been edited for length. To download the entire transcript in PDF form, please click here.

EDITED TRANSCRIPT

Subject: Gerald Patout
Date: June 18, 2008
Location: Arnold LeDoux Library—Eunice, LA
Interviewer: Sara Roahen

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This is Sara Roahen for the Southern Foodways Alliance. It’s Wednesday, June 18, 2008. I’m in Eunice, Louisiana. I’m with Mr. Gerald Patout. If I could get you to state your name how you say it and your birth date, and tell us your profession, I’d appreciate it.

My name is Gerald Patout. I’m a junior. I was born in New Iberia, Louisiana [on] February 23, 1950. I’m presently the Director of the Arnold LeDoux Library here at Louisiana State University at Eunice, and I just recently arrived here, being appointed in January of this year. For the last 10 years I was the Head Librarian at the Historic New Orleans Collection in the French Quarter.

To start out, could you tell me a little bit about your family heritage?

Right. I have a very interesting and I think unique ancestral line. [Laughs] My mother and father were both Patouts—distant cousins. My mother hailed from Lydia, Louisiana, which is just outside of New Iberia—Lydia Plantation—and her family are the sugarcane and sugar planter Patouts that currently and still own MA Patout and Sons Enterprise Plantation, considered today one of the oldest continuously operating American businesses, still in family hands. The Patouts came--the early Patouts came to Louisiana, that branch—well that started the Patout clan in Louisiana in 1825, Simeon Patout. And they were going to plant grapes actually and it didn’t work out, so they got into the sugarcane business and the rest is history. And there’s a book written about the Patouts and the history of the Patout family. Dr. Michael Wade at East Carolina University published a book called Sugar Dynasty. So there is quite a bit of archival information, family history about those early Patouts and their struggles in the cane business and how that business has grown to what it is today. So that’s my family, my mother’s side of the family.

My father’s side of the family was also related to those early Patouts but his relatives and descendants came from Patoutville to town, so to speak. And we would say town was New Iberia from Patoutville. And his grandfather, my father, Gerald Patout, Sr., was Felix Patout— Felix was his grandfather, rather, and his father was Frederic Patout. And Frederic Patout and some of his brothers owned the Hotel Frederic in New Iberia, which was a landmark on Main Street in New Iberia for many, many years. And like all downtown areas and the evolving cultural and Main Street landscapes of our small towns, the Hotel Frederic fell prey to the changing of the Main Street and the interstate arriving and the four-lane further out of New Iberia and the location of other motels and chains. And so the Hotel Frederic went out of business, I think in the 1960s.

In that capacity, my father and his brother, Eugene Patout, or Gene Patout, ran Gene & Gerald’s Restaurant on Main Street in the Hotel Frederic for many, many years, which was a fixture of--of downtown New Iberia. And as a child it was sort of a--my learning laboratory that I began my interest in food and seeing how food is prepared, serving the Kiwanis Club and the Rotary Club and my grandmother hosting events in the Gold Room at the Historic—at the Hotel Frederic. She would have Garden Club parties and large, large events, and to see all of these events unfold and the catering and the food and the food preparation was really a learning experience for me.

And from--from the Hotel Frederic experience I’m sure my taste-buds grew and my interest grew and I began my own career in various aspects of--in the academic world. And I earned a degree from the University of Louisiana at Lafayette in 1972, and then later pursued a degree in—an advanced degree in Education at the Old Dominion University in Norfolk, Virginia. And my first library job was in Colonial Williamsburg in Williamsburg, Virginia.

I then pursued another library degree at Louisiana State University, an MLIS, and earned that in 1988. I continued my studies with an advanced library degree at Columbia University which brings me to the point of my story. My first food library job was in New York City when I—after I finished Columbia University I became the Head Librarian, Corporate Librarian, for Domino’s Sugar Corporation in New York, which was a remarkable experience for a person of my [Laughs] connections in Louisiana to the sugar industry. And it was an unusual experience also to couple with library work.

After about four years in New York at the Domino’s Sugar Library I returned to Louisiana and I became--eventually became the Head Librarian at the Historic New Orleans Collection located in the French Quarter, which is again another one of these remarkable experiences that one has in a career. The Historic New Orleans Collection is a private foundation dedicated to the assets related to Louisiana and New Orleans history and culture, and food could not be a bigger part [Laughs] of New Orleans’ history and culture—as well as music, but food—.

Having completed that tenure at the Historic New Orleans Collection, after 10 years I returned home here to Eunice, Louisiana, and well, to--to Southwest Louisiana and Acadiana. And I’ve landed here at the LeDoux Library at LSU Eunice, as I’ve said, and I plan on continuing to expand the cookbook collection here at the LeDoux Library, determining exactly what we have, what we’d like to have in terms of Cajun cookbooks, and become the definitive Cajun cookbook repository in this area, which supports some very rich and interesting food traditions here in this part of Louisiana

I’m under the impression or the…I have the romantic belief that people in this area of the state and of the country still cook and eat together more than they do in other parts.

Well I--I agree with you; I tend to think that this disintegration of the family and the family unit at the food table and at the dinner table has not taken hold quite as much here in Acadiana for a variety of different reasons. First of all this is a rural area and they’re small towns in which family units make up the communities, and I think they’re generally solid. I think these families do have distractions, and the same distractions that families in Chicago and New York and everyone else has: TVs and Internet and e-content and all of these other things that pull them away from the dinner table. And I also think these families have these new demands placed on them from schools and achievements and accomplishments. And I think these families are also two-parent, working-parent families. But at the same time I think they struggle to get back to the dinner table here in French South Louisiana, because they’re French and that was a custom and a tradition that the Creoles and the Cajuns I think both had, was to have dinner around the table or lunch and talk and that joie de vivre spirit of talking and story-telling was very important. So I don’t think quite as many families are distracted by the external noises out there, but I do--I do think there are some that it’s easier to roll through McDonald’s or pick up a Subway or the pizzas and stuff like that. But I do think there are some families that continue to cook those dishes, or maybe simpler dishes that are easy to--easier to serve and provide family access to so that a good meal is in the home.

Let me ask you about boudin. Was boudin a part of your childhood?

I remember boudin—as a child growing up in the country—that there would be available links of boudin and I’m not actually sure that I enjoyed it. I do remember that we had it with hogshead cheese that was made in the country, and I don’t think I enjoyed it as much--as much as I do now. And again my beginnings in tasting boudin, the interest was in the fact that it was a rice dressing, and a rice dressing put in casing. And again my experiences with rice dressing were the rice dressings that my two grandmothers made and were served at Christmastime or dinners and stuff like that. So if it was a good rice dressing then I really enjoyed it.

Could you explain for the record what rice dressing is, and also how your two grandmothers’ rice dressings differed?

I--the rice dressings were sort of the carbohydrate staple at our meals, one of those offerings that was of course fundamentally made of rice. Now in terms of rice I remember there was--there were no rice cookers as a child. I remember they cooked rice in a pot and—white rice—and the process for cooking the rice dressing was pretty simple. It was ground beef and pork that was cooked together in--in a gravy. And I’m sure there was stock—onions, bell peppers, the trinity cooked down, and I do remember also in my grandmothers’ rice dressings that the chicken gizzards, chicken livers, and the necks were boiled in another pot, a separate pot and that could have been done before too, and sometimes that stock in that pot was poured into the cooking pot of ground beef and ground pork. And I always heard them talking about that it was--it was tasty to have half and half: If you could get ground pork, that was good too because it made for a good match, good flavor and good taste. And so I’ve always kind of adhered to that myself. I--I make rice dressing with just ground beef, but if you can get half ground pork and half ground beef, then that was what my grandmothers did. And then of course they cooked that down and then when it got to a certain consistency—and as a cook you kind of know when it’s time to start to adding the rice—you spooned the rice in and they would mix it. But--but a little bit before that they--I do know that they would chop the chicken livers, a little bit of the gizzards, and they would—the neck, the meat that was on the neck would be pulled off and it was also very tasty and it was chopped very fine, very, very fine, and a certain amount of it had to be added; not too much, particularly because it would get too much of that flavor of the gizzard or the liver. And--and the neck meat was also very important because it added a special flavor. And that was added into the ground beef and the cooking pork. And so then all of these things were brought together in a pot and then mixed nice together with a consistency that was—it adhered and it had a wonderful odor. And then I always remember sort of the crowning ingredients were onion tops and parsley were sprinkled in there.

And of course during this time of adding all these things into a pot, and where the seasoning was going on, and I suspect it was your traditional red pepper, salt, and--and black pepper. And then throughout the years I guess I was paying more attention. I listened to them say, Well we don’t add as much black pepper; we use white pepper instead of black pepper. And you know different people add spices and seasonings, but those were the primary seasonings that were added. And I think if I recall sugar--a little bit of brown sugar was always sprinkled in there too as an enhancer--flavor enhancer. A little bit of sugar. And I don’t remember the exact proportions because the pots varied and the sizes and the amounts they were cooking.

The only thing I can say about the differences in my two grandmothers’ cooking is, again, my grandmother in the country at Lydia Plantation had her own style so to speak, and she did a lot of the cooking herself. I know that there was help but I don’t remember—I remember her managing the cooking, more doing the cooking; and in town, my grandmother in town had help in the kitchen that--that were cooking these dishes and stuff like that. She would be overseeing working with that person, so if there was any differential it would be--be that, but largely the tastes and the flavors—. And I do remember that both my grandmothers were very friendly and complimentary and they loved each other’s cooking, and when they were together they would talk about Cousin Myrtle’s hogshead cheese, or my grandmother in town made wonderful Christmas candies and cookies and sweets and things. So they had different skills and expertises, but they did appreciate one another and I know they talked about it, you know, and their foods and how they prepared [them], so they probably picked up from one another their tips on how to make divinity or Russian rocks or rice dressings or things that they did—chow-chow. My grandmother in the country—or hogshead cheese and patés and things like that.

So in your vocabulary, is there a difference between rice dressing and dirty rice?

Not really. I mean I wouldn’t draw that distinction. I mean I think if you’re going to make a dirty rice, that’s probably just a real quick rice dressing—to me—and you wouldn’t have these other ingredients. You might not have pork; you might not have the chicken livers or gizzards or—and other people add different things, so I would think dirty rice is just kind of like that gravy with the meat in it. You could put a little onion tops and parsley on it and it--and it looks kind of dirty, but it’s very tasty. And rice dressing takes a little bit more strength, a little bit more pizzazz, a little bit more work to it and stuff like that. And then when of course you put good rice dressing in a casing, people call that boudin. And then you know they--they take that in different directions too.

When you were younger, growing up, in what context would you eat boudin—do you remember?

It was generally sort of like an appetizer. I don’t recall eating boudin as a meal, but that’s just me. It was there out on maybe the stove and people would cut a piece, and it was in the afternoon if I remember correctly in--in terms of a time period. I don’t remember eating boudin in the morning, and maybe other people do but that--that’s the context in which we we had it at my grandmother’s. And it could have been--and it could have been an appetizer at a party and stuff like that. Or, I kind of remember that.

Do you think that the boudin that you had at your grandmother’s was homemade or do you think she purchased that?

I think she actually purchased that. I don’t recall her making boudin, although they made sausage in the country and they had a smokehouse in Lydia. I cannot say that I recall my grandmother’s boudin but I do know she made hogshead cheese; they made cracklings, and as I say chow-chow and things like that. And I would have to check with my mother and them to ask if--if my Grandmother Patout in Lydia made boudin.
        
What about as a—I mean either from your experience being from here or as a scholar and a librarian, what is your understanding of the origins of Cajun boudin?

My understanding is--is at this point [Laughs] pretty shallow in that it’s not like some of the other things that I’ve studied and addressed—cookbooks—and I would like to know more about it. But having said that, I would think that the origins of boudin here in Southwest Louisiana are predicated on the fact the ingredients were here in this area with the right groups of people, the ethnic groups of people coming together. You had Germans here in Southwest Louisiana at Roberts Cove that made sausage and so you had the casing or the ability to make sausage. You have rice and you had rice formers. Let’s not forget that, you know, you had Native Americans in this area. You have the French. It’s what made New Orleans Creole, all of these ethnic groups, and I think the same contingent of contributing factors reside here in Southwest Louisiana, the same influences, the ingredient palate, the ethnicities, the--the ability to get to these ingredients and then putting them together in a way like the rice dressing and putting it in a casing. I think that’s how boudin evolved, but that’s not--not based in fact. I will get there one day. Now that I’m in the heart of this area to--to ask more questions, to find out from more people and to do the type of research that I need to do. But based on what I know about jambalaya—and I wrote a little article on jambalaya for the Spanish Society and gave a little presentation when I was in the Historic New Orleans Collection—and--and how jambalaya evolved and rice came to Louisiana. I think you can use the same model of research that developed that dish from paella in Spain to jambalaya here in Louisiana—with the African Americans, the Spanish, the French all contributing some kind of way to that dish. And then here in Southwest Louisiana you have the same kinds of things coming together, the need to enjoy food and--and the ingredients that you have here and the fact that, as I said, I think the Germans and the sausage makers played an important role in probably bringing the casing to the introduction—would be my guestimate.

What about your experience with boudin now? You’ve moved back to this area—how often do you eat it and in what context?

Well I--I’m not a boudin eater every day. Every once in a while I’ll pick up a--a piece or a link, or if I’m having company for wine and cheese [Laughs] I’ll pick up some boudin, but it’s all experimental for me since I’ve only been here since January. And I keep asking questions as to where’s the—to get the best boudin, because I think when you invite people over or you entertain your own family or your own palate it’s all—I love to know where is the best of this or that. And so I keep asking questions around here in Eunice and stopping here there and yonder, and we’ll taste and determine eventually which one I really like the best.

This might not be a question that you can answer yet, but what is—do you have an impression on what boudin means to the people in this area; how important it is to day-to-day life?

Well I think--I think it’s like music or anything else. It’s--it’s a cultural symbol for them; it represents what’s good about their daily routines and their lifestyle. And I say that because even on a sort of tangential way, [Laughs] some of--some boudin is not necessarily the traditional boudin. Someone was telling me about a crawfish boudin that’s being made and sold and stuffed into a casing. And so in an endearing way, if they’re putting crawfish into boudin—the crawfish and rice and all of these things are--are so important to the culture here, and so to put it into and to be a part of boudin, which is something that most people love, must be a symbol of--of something good and that tastes good and that feels good. So that’s what I think is important to the culture. And so--and they also combine boudin with fun things, events and--and music and all these things feel good together and are good about the culture and positive. And--and so, and it speaks to the history of how this has evolved and stuff, so I think that’s all really, really positive.

Can you tell us a little bit about the different boudins that you’ve tried in this area?

I’ve actually only tried the--the boudin at the slaughterhouse [Eunice Superette & Slaughterhouse] and I have not tried [Laughs] any of the blood boudin. And I think I picked up a link at T-Boy’s [Slaughterhouse] right there on Maple Street, which also makes cracklings. Somebody recommended that and I picked up a—they were all very good and tasty. Some of it was spicier and hotter than others and I--I would prefer it not to be red-hot and peppery hot, but tasty.

Visitors [to New Orleans] often want to try boudin and I tell them they need to come out to Cajun country. Do you have any ideas about why that might be the case?

I don’t know; it’s sort of like the cracklings either, or you know there are a few dishes that simply have not made it in--into New Orleans. And I don’t know whether people associate boudin with a certain class of people, a certain group of people, and it’s a stereotypical type thing. But you’re definitely right having lived in New Orleans and certainly appreciating the food culture there. It’s not one of those kinds of things that you find on a--a menu or you go to a cocktail party, whereas around here in Southwest Louisiana it--it is cocktail party food or served readily as an appetizer or things like that.

I’m curious about how you--how you go about serving it in a cocktail party atmosphere?

We always, or I’ve served—where it would be cut into small slices and there would be a toothpick placed in it, and that little piece that was cut would hold together, and--and that’s the way that I’ve seen it served at cocktail parties. Sometimes there’s no toothpicks and there’s napkins next to a serving dish and people pick up a link. Now I’ve also served in sort of a very country style on a wooden board with a knife next to it and people cut their own piece off a link, and there are small plates to--to serve with it, and again napkins, to be—to be eaten with the fingers.
        
So you cook it and then cut it?

Right, yeah, and I know that probably a lot of times it’s—in catering events it’s left in rice cookers behind the scenes and then brought out onto trays. To keep it warm they put it in rice cookers because of course a rice cooker keeps the rice wonderfully well ready to serve.

For a final question I’d like to know what you like the most about your job.

I like the ability to work with people and help people. Here in the library is a--a place where you know people are coming to get information, to find books, to learn something, to execute an assignment or an exercise and to be a part of that and provide them with the resources to answer questions—it’s very rewarding to me. I as a child grew up with lots of books. My grandmother in town had a library in her house, besides cookbooks, and in that library she shared with us great books that took us places. So I’ve always been book-oriented; we participated in summer reading programs in the library and I’ve always been fascinated by information. And now we—it’s just a remarkable the amount of information that we have at our fingertips. I think the Internet and online databases and everything is fascinating. So it’s wonderful to work with that information—electronic and emerging information sources—but it’s also important for me to work with historic resources, the kinds of things that I’ve loved—I mean of pictures and ephemera like menus and pamphlets and cookbooks and those kinds of things, so I get the best of both worlds. It’s like you’re at the vortex of lots of information coming your way and being informed, and that’s good; that’s a good feeling.

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